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Thread: You are forced to sell your traff to Tubes through Traffic Holder

  1. #21
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    I have been selling/buying to/from Ravo and FPCtraffic for how much? 5 years already, day after day without stop?

    I can't say the same thing about any other broker or probably even any other adult sponsor. I guess it means a lot about his program and the way he runs it.
    Sinlords Network - 400k daily uniques, TGPs, blogs, video dumps, legal tubes, etc.
    Contact me for trades, hardlinks, advertisement deals, etc.
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  2. #22
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    Thanks for the kind words Icy! Yeah, it's been 5 years, wow.

  3. #23
    Adultcontent.nl office Notime's Avatar
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    No limit on the No. of sites you can block as a publisher at Ero-Advertising: Home
    Adultcontent.nl Legal content licensing - My Adultwhoswho.com - Ero-advertising.com - Promocash.nl - DVDdownload.nl - DVDdownload.com
    Email: cybersales@hetnet.nl - ICQ 224-498-108 - SKYPE jack.pijman (Mail me to set up an ICQ or skype please)

  4. #24
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    DaveM,

    I'm sorry that I didn't post earlier, I just found this post by accident.

    Please excuse our support that they told you its not possible to increase a limit
    for a Personal traffic selling blacklist. I will investigate that, its something that
    you should not expect. I have increased limit to 200 and if you need more, please just inform
    our support and they will do that as high as you need.

    Shane, Regarding 9% refund fee. I should explain situation to make it clear for you.
    If you do ePurchase deposit, ePassporte charge us 9% fee to load your funds to our business
    account. When you request a refund, we just apply this fee for you, because our competitors
    abused us by doing multiply loads and then ask for a refund in the past. We lose money when
    we do that for free, because as I said you ePassporte charged us 9% to load your funds.

    Normally, yes, you should contact ePassporte to get ePurchase refund without fee. Thats why
    we have asked fee for this. Please understand that, its not a problem for us to refund money for
    free for you, but as we were abused few times with that, our Supervisor has added this rule.

    Thank you for understanding.

    Ilona Guitz
    TH Administrator
    Last edited by Ilona; December 29th, 2009 at 06:06 PM.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilona View Post
    DaveM,

    I'm sorry that I didn't post earlier, I just found this post by accident.

    Please excuse our support that they told you its not possible to increase a limit
    for a Personal traffic selling blacklist. I will investigate that, its something that
    you should not expect. I have increased limit to 200 and if you need more, please just inform
    our support and they will do that as high as you need.

    Shane, Regarding 9% refund fee. I should explain situation to make it clear for you.
    If you do ePurchase deposit, ePassporte charge us 9% fee to load your funds to our business
    account. When you request a refund, we just apply this fee for you, because our competitors
    abused us by doing multiply loads and then ask for a refund in the past. We lose money when
    we do that for free, because as I said you ePassporte charged us 9% to load your funds.

    Normally, yes, you should contact ePassporte to get ePurchase refund without fee. Thats why
    we have asked fee for this. Please understand that, its not a problem for us to refund money for
    free for you, but as we were abused few times with that, our Supervisor has added this rule.

    Thank you for understanding.

    Ilona Guitz
    TH Administrator
    There should be unlimited number for blacklist.Also ability for auto blacklisting any kind of tube site will come handy.

  6. #26
    I love AskDamageX.com Shane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilona View Post
    DaveM,
    Shane, Regarding 9% refund fee. I should explain situation to make it clear for you.
    If you do ePurchase deposit, ePassporte charge us 9% fee to load your funds to our business
    account. When you request a refund, we just apply this fee for you, because our competitors
    abused us by doing multiply loads and then ask for a refund in the past. We lose money when
    we do that for free, because as I said you ePassporte charged us 9% to load your funds.

    Normally, yes, you should contact ePassporte to get ePurchase refund without fee. Thats why
    we have asked fee for this. Please understand that, its not a problem for us to refund money for
    free for you, but as we were abused few times with that, our Supervisor has added this rule.
    Well what pisses me off i deposited money 3 times never one time got hit for a fee. You had a good bit of pornstar sites so i figured i would buy more traffic from you. Noticed the return was slow and you had that "pro" button or whatever to be able to get traffic faster. So did that by putting your shitty banner at the bottom of my site which is bullshit but thiers no other way. I bite my tongue and went on. Then i make a deposite the same way i always did get hit for 6.5%. Then that really pissed me off and i asked for a refund. At that point you charged me 9% fucking more so yeah i was a bit on the pissed off side. I have a hard time believing that it cost you 15.5% and you know that I am not a "competitor" trying to milk you. I had a pretty lengthy ticket and i assure you no one offered any "free" refund.

    Its sad becuase i buy 2k or so in traffic every month. Thats not alot but for fucks sakes why not take care of the origional issue refund me my 6.5% deposite fee and we would have been straight from thier on out. You told me in the supprot ticket you do not charge "new users" the 6.5% but do after i become verified. Again that seems ass backwards.

    And also i am not sure what type of filers you guys run but i see a ton of botters selling traffic to honest webmasters. I think you may want to look over some of the sites that sell you traffic.......but i am sure with your awesome customer service it does not matter as long as you make your % it seems you don't mind fucking people.

    Good luck with those practices in 2010 as the adult game gets tighter and tighter.

    PornStar Traffic & Trades

  7. #27
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    Shane,

    Thank you for a reply. When buyer has been verified, buyer gets a list of our epassporte
    accounts to load money by doing p2p transfer. As alternate option, buyer still can load money
    thru ePurchase interface, but he will be charged 6.5% for that (because as I said you, ePurchase
    charges us 9% fee), so to load money without fee, you just need to do p2p transfer to one of
    the ePassporte accounts listed at your admin area.

    I didn't know that you have already charged 6.5% for load, in this case, you just need to add
    additional 2.5% for a refund, not 9%. Normally verified buyers load money by doing p2p transfer
    to one of our ePassporte accounts. In this case refund will be also issued for free.

    In order to get more traffic, do not use PRO feature, but use STATS where you can see your
    order position and improve it.

    I have found your account at our system and returned you full refund charge. Again, support
    was wrong with you, I just read ticket history. If you paid 6.5% already, you should not pay
    9% for a refund. I will investigate & fix that. Thank you for understanding.

    JakobKell, unfortunately to setup unlimited limits we are limited at the technical side. We can setup
    higher limits by request. Thank you for understanding.
    Last edited by Ilona; December 31st, 2009 at 07:58 AM.

  8. #28
    I love AskDamageX.com Shane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilona View Post
    Shane,

    Thank you for a reply. When buyer has been verified, buyer gets a list of our epassporte
    accounts to load money by doing p2p transfer. As alternate option, buyer still can load money
    thru ePurchase interface, but he will be charged 6.5% for that (because as I said you, ePurchase
    charges us 9% fee), so to load money without fee, you just need to do p2p transfer to one of
    the ePassporte accounts listed at your admin area.

    I didn't know that you have already charged 6.5% for load, in this case, you just need to add
    additional 2.5% for a refund, not 9%. Normally verified buyers load money by doing p2p transfer
    to one of our ePassporte accounts. In this case refund will be also issued for free.

    In order to get more traffic, do not use PRO feature, but use STATS where you can see your
    order position and improve it.

    I have found your account at our system and returned you full refund charge. Again, support
    was wrong with you, I just read ticket history. If you paid 6.5% already, you should not pay
    9% for a refund. I will investigate & fix that. Thank you for understanding.

    JakobKell, unfortunately to setup unlimited limits we are limited at the technical side. We can setup
    higher limits by request. Thank you for understanding.
    Well i appreciate the refund but it really does me no good becuase you can't withdraw less then 50 bucks so i guess that one just sites. Also you need to address the issue of the know hitbotters that are selling you traffic. Good for you bad for the buyer......

    PornStar Traffic & Trades

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shane View Post
    Well i appreciate the refund but it really does me no good becuase you can't withdraw less then 50 bucks so i guess that one just sites. Also you need to address the issue of the know hitbotters that are selling you traffic. Good for you bad for the buyer......
    Shane, its not good for traffic broker to sell "hit bot" traffic. It will result in drop
    of buying ratio and total collapse of traffic brokering system. Some brokers are
    collapsed due to weak anti-cheating modules and monitoring control.

    I do not see anything wrong at our traffic monitoring system. May you provide me few
    samples of hitbot traffic selling domains so we will investigate it deeper?

  10. #30
    Respected Webmaster Dred's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilona View Post
    Shane, its not good for traffic broker to sell "hit bot" traffic. It will result in drop
    of buying ratio and total collapse of traffic brokering system. Some brokers are
    collapsed due to weak anti-cheating modules and monitoring control.

    I do not see anything wrong at our traffic monitoring system. May you provide me few
    samples of hitbot traffic selling domains so we will investigate it deeper?
    See, this is why i get my traffic elsewhere...ignorance is not bliss nor an excuse.

    I'm sure y'all have gotten many an email about KNOWN hitbotters.

    If you can't dazzle them with brilliance
    -- Baffle them with bullshit. (GFY Bro Club)

  11. #31
    I love AskDamageX.com Shane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilona View Post
    Shane, its not good for traffic broker to sell "hit bot" traffic. It will result in drop
    of buying ratio and total collapse of traffic brokering system. Some brokers are
    collapsed due to weak anti-cheating modules and monitoring control.

    I do not see anything wrong at our traffic monitoring system. May you provide me few
    samples of hitbot traffic selling domains so we will investigate it deeper?
    Unfortuenly i cannot police your sellers for you but i assure you that you have a good bit of know botters and i am sure others on this board who have been around abit like me will agree with me. Not sure how your filter works but it needs some fine tuning

    PornStar Traffic & Trades

  12. #32
    I love AskDamageX.com Shane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dred View Post
    See, this is why i get my traffic elsewhere...ignorance is not bliss nor an excuse.

    I'm sure y'all have gotten many an email about KNOWN hitbotters.
    100% true. That was another determining factor with me not doing business with TH once they poped me for the extra fees. I looked around a bit more and saw all the known botters with sell orders by thier name thinking wow someone is getting fucked sideways. Paying 3 bucks for 1k hitbots lol.

    PornStar Traffic & Trades

  13. #33
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    Shane, unfortunately I'm unable to investigate it without details. Sometimes we hear about websites which use cheating
    practices to generate traffic, but the traffic we receive from them is quite normal. If they cheat someone to generate traffic,
    we can only block them for a "bad business practices", but we should receive more details. If you bought traffic from
    TrafficHolder and we sent you "hitbot" traffic, you may ask us for a full refund + compensation. However, nobody
    complained about that.
    Last edited by Ilona; January 2nd, 2010 at 07:13 AM.

  14. #34
    I love AskDamageX.com Shane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilona View Post
    Shane, unfortunately I'm unable to investigate it without details. Sometimes we hear about websites which use cheating
    practices to generate traffic, but the traffic we receive from them is quite normal. If they cheat someone to generate traffic,
    we can only block them for a "bad business practices", but we should receive more details. If you bought traffic from
    TrafficHolder and we sent you "hitbot" traffic, you may ask us for a full refund + compensation. However, nobody
    complained about that.
    Well with that reply I guess you know what i am talking about. You know that some of your clients hitbot the fuck out of other sites, steal their traffic, then send you back the clean traffic. Kinda like money laundering lol. Looks to be a good set up. But if you know some of the people are selling you traffic in this manner how long before they fuck you as well? Its so easy to do.

    Let me break it down for you in a simple way to understand (but i am sure you already know how they are doing it). They are cheating my sites and they are cheating your system plain and simple. They are using maleware not a standard hitbot. It is indeed real surfers computers clicking links just no one is in the drivers seat....do i need to explain futher?

    PornStar Traffic & Trades

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    Shane, I think you speaking about "real browsers" hitbots. Normally, its a thousands of
    trojan infected computers, so traffic patterns generated by these hitbot networks usually
    looks like normal traffic patterns, but detection of such networks is still possible.

    Our system, during traffic tests, randomly choose thumbs to show, some of them
    should produce less clicks, some of them much more. During test stage we test if
    click patterns are correspond with a predicted difference. Browser hitbots show
    equal number of clicks to both type of thumbs, because they "do not know" if this
    specific thumb is popular or not. Its easy method can detect browser based hitbots..
    There are much more methods we use, but this one works perfectly well
    (if you update thumbs often and their positions are different).

    However, browsed based hitbots are expensive to use, thats why they are used
    to cheat CJ or a traffic broker in a very rare cases. Cheaters normally use them to
    cheat PPS/PPC based services as they provide much higher price per click.

  16. #36
    I love AskDamageX.com Shane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilona View Post
    Shane, I think you speaking about "real browsers" hitbots. Normally, its a thousands of
    trojan infected computers, so traffic patterns generated by these hitbot networks usually
    looks like normal traffic patterns, but detection of such networks is still possible.

    Our system, during traffic tests, randomly choose thumbs to show, some of them
    should produce less clicks, some of them much more. During test stage we test if
    click patterns are correspond with a predicted difference. Browser hitbots show
    equal number of clicks to both type of thumbs, because they "do not know" if this
    specific thumb is popular or not. Its easy method can detect browser based hitbots..
    There are much more methods we use, but this one works perfectly well
    (if you update thumbs often and their positions are different).

    However, browsed based hitbots are expensive to use, thats why they are used
    to cheat CJ or a traffic broker in a very rare cases. Cheaters normally use them to
    cheat PPS/PPC based services as they provide much higher price per click.
    actually they are not. I have heard of traffic brokers actually selling them for $1 per k. I am not going to name names that are suspose to be selling them becuase I cannot verify it yet. And I will never accuse someone blindly. But I can tell you that alot of people that are selling you traffic are using them and either passing it to their trades and sending you the good traffic (but like you said its not cheating you guys this way so its ok) or sending directly to the trade. I have a script that catches them at well.

    PornStar Traffic & Trades

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    We are against these practices, but there is very little we can do to prevent it.

    Even if we block websites which cheat someone in this way, they will move their traffic
    to other brokers. Even if all brokers will block them, they will move their traffic directly
    to trojans/viruses, etc. They will find the way to monetize traffic they steal.

  18. #38
    Jack-of-all-trades JACOBKELL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilona View Post
    We are against these practices, but there is very little we can do to prevent it.

    Even if we block websites which cheat someone in this way, they will move their traffic
    to other brokers. Even if all brokers will block them, they will move their traffic directly
    to trojans/viruses, etc. They will find the way to monetize traffic they steal.
    You can hire someone who is expert in anti cheat field and problem solved.I see TH going to shitter beacuse there is toomany sellers which resulting by quality seller traffic stay unsold compared to non quality sellers which probaly sell more traffic(they have bigger sold percentage).In shortly it is time for TH to kick bad sellers.
    Last edited by JACOBKELL; January 5th, 2010 at 11:30 AM.

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by JACOBKELL View Post
    You can hire someone who is expert in anti cheat field and problem solved.I see TH going to shitter beacuse there is toomany sellers which resulting by quality seller traffic stay unsold compared to non quality sellers which probaly sell more traffic(they have bigger sold percentage).In shortly it is time for TH to kick bad sellers.
    In fact, the higher selling percentage and higher price get the seller with a biggest volume of direct orders.

    So, the better traffic quality is - the more traffic will be sold and the higher traffic price seller will get.

    In order to get the highest quality traffic - you should purchase traffic by domain, pick up the best ones.
    Last edited by Ilona; January 5th, 2010 at 01:13 PM.

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilona View Post
    In fact, the higher selling percentage and higher price get the seller with a biggest volume of direct orders.

    So, the better traffic quality is - the more traffic will be sold and the higher traffic price seller will get.

    In order to get the highest quality traffic - you should purchase traffic by domain, pick up the best ones.
    This started to happen after new year-overall sold percentage dropped from 83% to 71%,and i noticed number of buyers dropped from 660 to 440,plus avaible traffic is much larger then before.Tehnicly this is nothing unusual and can be resolved by simply bringing more buyers but it still suck.

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